2023 Taini Jamison Trophy – NZ v England (Sep)

2023 Taini Jamison Trophy – NZ v England (Sep)2023-05-03T11:53:25+10:00
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  • Avatar photoIan Harkin
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      capsule
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        Post count: 99

        Wow I find it very odd that there wasn’t prior consultation between the countries regarding details including player availability. Sympathetic to NNZ here seeing as they’re the ones selling the tickets.

        Tully
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          Post count: 1958

          It’s an interesting one. I understand English fans saying if you watched NSL you’d understand the players are great, sure they are but you can’t take away that not one of them made the WC team. There is a big difference between resting senior players with niggling injuries and the entire team.

          I do think England should have advised NNZ of their intentions. NNZ are entitled to that awareness especially after the Jamaican series last year.

          None the less it will remain a competitive series unlike the Jamaican one. Hopefully it fires up the Ferns!

          For me the main issue is the coach not attending. That sends more of a message as to how they are treating the series.

          Avatar photoIan Harkin
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            TB
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              Post count: 1302

              England is really using both NZ and Aus to develop their players. They have taken this whole new “4 year cycle” to another level.

              Personally I find this very disrespectful. You can’t be using international games as training/developing sessions. Understandable resting one or two (possibly 3 – which would equal 1 player from each third) players…………but literally the whole team!

              It’s no wonder why our sport, netball, is left behind while other female codes are growing at a rapid pace. Amateur stuff like this, does not help our cause.

              And as @Tully said, even Englands head coach is not coming ???? That’s the cherry on the cake!

              Avatar photoIan Harkin
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                cookiesnjam
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                  After some deep pondering, I can only say that I feel for both sides here. This Taini Jamison Series was always going to be unique, due to the passing of Tani Jamison. Choosing a team consisting of only new and fresh faces would definitely not be seen as rude as this series is in honour of her and it is perfectly understandable that people will be mad. Furthermore, given how Jamaica treated this series last year it’s no surprise that New Zealand Netball would be greatly disappointed by this England squad.

                  On the other hand, the England Roses are preparing for a new cycle and hence the new players selected for this squad. I don’t fully agree with how they added literally all new faces and like I said in a previous post, I would have liked to see the likes of Fadoju and Tchine added into the squad. I also understand that Jess Thirlby’s father passed away just right before the World Cup which is heartbreaking and I hence will assume she’s sitting out of the series in order to take some time off. The amount of hate the side is receiving right now is really bad IMHO, as those players are absolutely class players and deserve the oppurtunity to play.

                  Based on articles I have read on this incident, all I can say is that England Netball needs to have better communication. This isn’t the first time that England Netball has been caught in debacles because of their poor communication. Had England Netball communicated their purpose earlier, I believe that this incident would not have happened. All in all, I feel for both sides and can understand where each side is coming from. Here’s hoping that this series would be an enjoyable one:)

                  capsule
                  Participant
                    Post count: 99

                    I suppose I can’t agree that it’s appropriate for any of the top nations with professional players to treat test matches as merely part of a world cup cycle. If netball wants to be successful, more efforts need to be made into promoting these series as meaningful in their own right. Particular when right now it doesn’t even feel as though netball can guarantee that the NWC will bring the attention and revenue it deserves. Other sports show the value of taking test series seriously.

                    I also don’t think that I can agree that sending a squad without experienced players to play an entire series against a top 4 team is a good approach to player development, but I guess that remains to be seen. I hope the players are well-supported and have a great experience.

                    Fluffy
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                      Post count: 224

                      Well said Cookiesnjam – once again England Netball’s communications failings let them all down. At the end of the day, this is a squad of England Roses, albeit not the 12 from NWC. Those players deserve some down time – they’ve earned it. And when do the other squad members get their chance to stake their claim to a starting 7 place otherwise?

                      What’s disrepectful in my book is the way these players are being demeaned as “also rans”. While I’d have taken Tchine and maybe Fadoju to cement the line up, there’s still plenty of talent here. That NZ fans aren’t paying attention to the line up coming their way says more about their insularity than anything else in my book: UK netball fans might not see Kiwis playing every day, but we sure do appreciate their skills when they step on court.

                      TB
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                        Yet NZ can field their top team available. Let’s remember they were also at the recent WC, they also had a huge and long build up for that campaign. Could argue they had the longest out of everyone.
                        Let’s reverse this. Let’s say NZ was to send their B team to England, to face their top line up? You cannot say to me that England Netball would not think that’s a slap in the face.

                        England is giving me that “let’s give everybody a go” vibe. Sorry but that’s not professional at all.

                        *I was unaware of Thirlby’s father passing! I sincerely apologise for judging her for her absence.

                        Flb
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                          I think it is a big contrast to the Australian mentality where you really have to earn selection in the squad let alone making it on court, (particularly in the Norma days)! Does it undermine what it means to be an English Rose?

                          I also wonder about what it does for team morale when you don’t have much experience on court guiding you in your first international. Then you wonder how useful the whole “blooding” experience is for the future anyway if it is a drubbing and if you don’t have incumbent players there to uphold team standards and culture?

                          I have nothing against the players selected and I hope they prove everyone wrong and perform really well, but it seems overkill. It isn’t even close to a 50/50 mix of experience and green players. Players do need to be rested from time to time, but not all at once!

                          As has been said I really don’t think it helps the game and it’s broader perception. Think of all the amazing NZ v Australia games over the years outside of world cups and CWG – can you imagine if one of the sides did this for a whole series and took away the intensity and contest that fans were expecting to see?

                          mcleod
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                            Well the 2nd year in a row, the TJ series has been treated with disrespect. And then to read yesterday England NZ were obliged to send a full senior representative side. Well clearly this is certainly not.
                            By the time the series starts, the WC England players would have had a almost 8 weeks break, how long do they actually need, bearing in mind 4 years ago the SSN re started 4 days later.

                            Netball is pushing to be in the 2032 Olympics, it’s got no show if countries keep pulling this crap, against the 2nd ranked team in the world.

                            Bring on the Con Cup. Netball Australia will send their best 12, and Stacey and her assistants will be there as well.

                            TB
                            Participant
                              Post count: 1302

                              Obviously we don’t know what goes on behind closed doors. But another interesting point, it doesn’t seem like any of the 12 players from the WC team seem bothered by this. Which in a lot of ways says to me, they are not threatened by their position in the team.


                              @mcleod
                              ???? agree re Olympics!

                              This is where DNT and co really need to up their game. Teams have lost the fear factor of coming up against the Ferns eg Jamaica and England. If this same series was happening against Diamonds right now, I highly doubt they’d be sending a B team.

                              thunder123
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                                NZ would want to be careful to not lose to this “second string” England side now.

                                mcleod
                                Participant
                                  Post count: 1870

                                  Yet England will field their top players against a team that lost to Uganda at the WC.
                                  Oh yes that’s right it’s played in England, no travel involved.

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